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Yuktaanand: Recently you talked about meditation being attention on attention.
But I wanted to check something: you’ve also said that we have to investigate,
and in that place of meditation we have to check or make the enquiry.
Now that I am more aware that meditation is attention on attention, it
is so blissful and wonderful. And at any moment when I shift from that,
it’s like I get shifted out of the Space. So I just wanted to check: when
that happens should I be making the enquiry at that time, or just remain
with the knowledge of attention on attention?
Swamiji: Because we had been non-meditators for a long time, therefore
our growth is by checking. I have tasted the bread to see whether it is
baked properly or not! Checking. So is the case with your camera. First
you handle the camera and film, and check if you have the right film.
So through checking you have grown in attaining the knowledge which is
appreciable and appreciated by others. They enjoy and you enjoy, because
we somehow have the sense of perfection. So anything which is perfect
we like it. Anything which is not perfect, because we are human beings
then our mind is not satisfied. Therefore, we are seeking a state of perfection.
Not knowing what perfection is, our method is of alphabet and figures,
so the grammar and the language should be perfect, and the addition and
subtraction should be perfect. And our living life should be perfect.
Eating perfect, walking perfect, playing perfect and all that. So this
is where checking is.
But here when you meditate that field is completely left alone. It has
got nothing to do with applying all the rules for which the relative field
is meant. Here you have settled in your chair. The senses are not in function,
but the mind, which is also called sense along with these five senses,
is in function. And it’s moving. Because it is moving, so the attention
is moving. And in mediation you are required to pay attention on attention.
That attention with closed eyes, whatever is, is not moving. Inside, that
is working, functioning, moving. So when moving wants to put the attention
on attention, it will not succeed, because it is moving. Therefore, when
your attention got fixed on attention that was the immobile state, and
there you settled. You are watching, and that is unchanging, immortal.
It does not change; attention is that which never changes. Everything
changes which is attended. But attention never changes, and a human being
has not been taught as to what is that which is never changing.
So now you have succeeded in realizing that unchanging. Then in the waking
state you are changing, so you ask what should I do? I say identify with
that; that is you, that is Jonty, unchanging. This Jonty which you have
told or people have told you is this body, that will not be you. Because
it has no knowledge of knowing you; the whole body has no knowledge of
knowing you. But you the Knower has the knowledge of knowing everything.
Nose and ears, and this and that, and like the doctors all the anatomy.
You all know that. So Knower is attention, and you cannot say Knower is
on Knower. Why? Knower alone is. Knower is free. So we are leading the
attention in meditation of those persons who have meditated less before,
or have not meditated, or do not know how to meditate. Then there are
various methods in the preliminary session that we give, and then we say
check. But there is nothing to check for you because you will check with
the mind, you will check with the intellect, and intellect is already
changing. And you will never find anything that is unchanging. Attention
is unchanging and only unchanging can see the unchanging. So checking
is not necessary.
It’s very, very difficult for a human being to know the Knower. All unrealized
people can know what the mind of a human being is speaking, what the senses
and emotions of a human being are doing, and even as to what is the quietness
of a human being. They can know because they can study psychology and
books and things like that and characters, and find out millions. You
have already heard me saying about the sand particles of the ocean, that
maybe somebody who is a master mathematician can count them, but he will
fail in counting the ways or waves of the mind. That much is there. Mind
cannot be enumerated with its thoughts. Even your own mind, how many thoughts
appeared in your mind, you cannot count. They are unaccountable. So it
will not be possible to control that which is before you. Therefore, there
must be some method of having the knowledge as to what is the meaning
of control of the mind. Like with waves of the ocean, how the ocean will
control the waves? We as human beings will immediately give the answer
that waves cannot be counted. But when it is said control your mind, control
the waves of your mind, it means the mind waves should be known that they
are the water. That’s all. Then you have control. So control your mind
means that you should know that mind is the Self.
And after that you will continue, because if you know that the vision
of the eyes is me, then whatever the eyes are seeing must be me. But you
have to know it that my vision is me. In the same way you have to know
my mind is me. Then it’s controlled. Then you will be knowing it, and
then you will be using it for the purpose it was meant for. But since
many people have no knowledge of that, then they are not able to control
because the meaning is so strangely put before a man. They say control
the mind like a horse, like a chariot horse. Control the car, control
the speed, control the senses, everything is control, control. What they
have been told is that you should control the way a rider controls a horse.
And that is where human beings could not succeed in knowing or controlling
the mind and the senses. One should know that senses are not senses, mind
is not mind, ego is not ego, and intellect is not intellect. If he knows
this, then what does he know? He knows that Self is. So if Self is, then
why would there be any necessity for the ocean water to control the waves?
It might appear to you as a new thing, but it is not. It is that way.
Just by knowing the Self you have controlled the whole body of a person
whose knowledge is only attuned to body. He says body, and he does not
know the source of the body. So he says, “Control the world.” You cannot
control the world. Try. Go anywhere, maybe you become an emperor and the
whole world is given to you, but you cannot. But if you know the whole
world is me, then you know that without me the world will not be having
any name on the paper, w-o-r-l-d, without me. So that sharpness of the
intellect of the human being pleases me.
For me each person is very, very important. Because it has been seen
that each person is the universe, and I see you daily in milliards of
colours and forms. Then how much more I view how many universes are in
you, each one. The more you expand yourself you come to know that that
which is called a small individual is the Being, in whom millions of universes
rest. So by looking at you I feel very happy and great because I can see
myself there, and especially when you come to know me, that is the state
of Oneness. And it has been realized that Oneness is the only remedy for
this ailing world, which is getting tormented and scattered because of
the forgetfulness of this Oneness. So you came to know the qualities and
characteristics of that Oneness, which is forever pure, free, unchanging.
Naturally it is not appearing, which means not taking birth, and not disappearing
which means not dying. And a human being is only taught that he is born
and he is going to die. It doesn’t matter that body is born or body dies,
but they say you are born and you are going to die. So the child hears
it and the whole emphasis is on body. Body is born because body is seen,
and child sees the body of others so he also begins to call himself body,
whereas no child sees his own body. Yet, he knows his body. Why? He knows
himself. So everyone who knows himself he knows that I. Even a newly born
birdie knows that I am. So it is the case with other manifestations. Yet,
it is to be reminded again and again, because we have got opposite information
that body is born, body is dying. And I am the whole body, so body is
I. This information has not been there. Just because body changes, body
appears, body disappears, thus the whole being became separated, and the
child came to know that I have a sense of separation that body is changing.
And he is there; he is knowing all the time. Knowing whom? He’s knowing
himself, and himself not separate at all. Himself is the body, and other
bodies, millions of bodies, the whole universe is the Self. And he knows
that, but the moment he’s individualized as a body form then the very
being who knows himself begins to know the body as the scene, or that
object which is seen. So he becomes subject and object, and division took
place.
Therefore, we wait for such persons or such beings, maybe one among millions
and millions, that he should be able to enquire as to what is this phenomenon
on the level of the mind and intellect: that we know and we do not know
at the same time? There is that which I do not know, and that which I
know, and this confusion takes place. Thus, we want to remove this confusion.
And if confusion is removed then it has always been Oneness; it was always
the ocean water. Because of the wave it became confusion. More waves,
more confusion. Then many forms of whirlpools and bubbles. More confusion.
So the same thing is for a human being that he is now calling himself
a wave, the body. And missing the source. So since the source is not being
seen with these human eyes, then we should either say they are right,
whatever they see, that is right. Or we should say there is a defect in
the eyes. We find out the defect in the eyes which, when we close them,
they do not see. When we open them they begin to see. Eyes are the same.
Which part do you want to attribute to the eyes?
So the field of senses is constituted in a way that human beings do not
know, though they have always been the Space. Nobody was anything else
which they call individual or changing individual; it has never been.
It was all Space; it was Pure Being; it was shuddh chaytan, Pure
Being. And the moment chaytana appeared, it became a wave. The
water of the ocean was always fluidity, but the moment it turned into
water the forgetfulness took place. So this chitt, the mind,
is nothing but Pure Consciousness, shuddh chaytan. But the moment
shuddh chaytan itself began to shine, then the sun says the sunshine
is separate from me. It is the sun. It’s a glory. So when you realize
Pure Consciousness then it is all glory. Ego is your own glory, mind is
your own glory, intellect and senses are your own glory, and body and
many bodies and multiple qualities of the bodies they are all nothing
but the shuddh chaytan, your own glory. And if it is your own
glory, then why glory will be separate?! Even as sunshine for the sun,
the wave to the water, heat for the wood fire, and the dream figures for
a dreamer. In the same way the whole universe which is seen with the help
of the eyes of an individual is nothing but the shuddh chaytan,
Pure Being, Pure Consciousness. A human being is gifted that he can check:
in the dream he sees the figures and there are no figures, but he sees
them. He sees the dream and experiences the dream, and dream figures are
experienced, dream things and scenes are experienced, but that which is
called experiencer, anubhaav, with which he experiences the subject
dream, the dreamer, and the objects, dream figures, he does not see that.
Because eyes cannot see that; his own experience cannot see that. Eyes
can see the forms, but they do not see the vision. In this way, sense
of Oneness has manifested itself, itself. If it is manifested, then why
would Oneness be anything else but Oneness? But this is the human constitution
who is not able to figure it out as to what example seen with the eyes
should be taken into consideration, and so that he should get connected
to the source. All human beings have tried. They became inquisitive, but
as I have said many times, without the Knower, without the Guru who knows
that there is no division anywhere, no answer is found. In the sky there
is no division and a human being knows this. But if there is no division,
then why does he not grasp that I am not divided?
That is where the blockage is, and we hear, and I speak. What happens
to you that you grasp and understand what I am saying? Because the voice
is nothing but the force of creativity of unity. The very force awakens
you, unites you, and ‘unites you’ means the Self which is separate unites
with you, the me, there, and that me is always there. So you begin to
get opened and begin to understand: Oh, Swamiji is saying the same that
I am knowing. But then ‘Swamiji is saying, and you are knowing’. The duality
still remains. What do we do? We practice that two forms are visibly separate,
but the one who knows the form number one and form number two, is the
same. The Knower who sees the forms of the dreams and the waking state,
all the forms, the Knower is one and the same. And when both the types
of forms are not seen, it is deep sleep, and the Knower knows that also.
So Knower knows anybody who appears, birth, and Knower also knows that
which disappears. It means Knower is forever the same. If Knower is forever
the same, then why is it that the object becomes different or subject
becomes different? In the laboratory like this we see people filled with
the sense of inquisitiveness. And they get together and want to understand.
There must be somebody who wants to enquire and understand because he
will be that person who knows that there is something, some drawback that
I know that I am, but why do I not understand? The reason is that you
have been living in the herd of people; those who have been moving towards
one side, always towards the death side. If one sheep goes in the well,
the whole well becomes full of thousands of sheep! [Laughing] People think
that money can control you. People think that the ropes can control, as
ropes control the bulls and animals, or as engines can be controlled.
So they became machine-minded, which means that which has been made and
that which dies. So people think body is made and body dies, and therefore
they are all machines. But the Knower of all the machines is Knower with
everybody. Knower is that which is permeating all, and if you are the
Knower then you know that Knower permeates all your senses and organs,
Knower permeates here and there, this and that, and then you become Knower
all-permeating.
What a big happening or expansion has taken place, and that is where
the importance of satsang is. When we get together, we understand and
we talk together, and then we unfold slowly and slowly our own knowledge
of these qualities of kaam, krod, lobh, moh and ahankaar
of which the world is made. Kaam is desire, krod is
anger, lobh is greed or possession, moh is attachment,
and ahankaar is pride, I am. And that’s the whole world of human
beings. And on the basis of that all other things are made. But how are
they there when they are not there in deep sleep? They are not in the
Pure Space. They are not before you are born. They are not after you die.
Then they are all in the middle. But whatever is in the middle, and source
is before beginning and source is after that, then why the source is not
the whole and source is all? In this way, slowly and slowly after hearing
we come to know that Swamiji is talking to me, the individual, that I
should be free from such ignorance that has blinded me of my own true
nature. Again and again many years passed and many situations have taken
place, and each one is capable of realizing his true nature. But he has
been so crystallized already by birth that the superimposed nature, or
the habits, became his reality.
So what do we do? We do not try to remove them, because there are layers
after layers, and even if you remove one part of the banana stem, another
part remains. Then again if you leave it, second is there. Third you leave,
the fourth is there! There’s nothing in banana but the leaves! [Laughing]
But when you come to know the Space, then you come to grasp that it’s
the Space always. Space was this leaf and that leaf, and this coat and
that coat. So the technique has become simple and personal for each individual
though it is universal, and whoever is can get the value, and they can
share with others. And those who do not want, don’t have to try or be
forced to understand it. But at least you have come to know that Space
I am, and I’m going to the machine which is changing all the time. Everybody
in the waking state is changing and changing, and they have their own
norm and standard of ideas. So you have to be the center of Space, and
then you are always Space. Because from Space the air arises, from Space
the fire arises, from Space the water arises, from Space the things and
forms arise and become, but they are at the center which is Space. Center
is not a point of a circle. Center means the whole. When you close the
eyes you will never be able to know a center like a circle center. The
whole is the center.
And now you have closed the eyes. Whatever is, is center. So the word,
concentration, has created difficulty for people because the language
has come from an individual. Whoever has brought the language, sounded
individual. And then they gave the words and they gave their own meanings.
In every country, every word has its own sound and it belongs to different
things and forms. Thus, we take you out of the word-field, of dictionary,
and the meaning, substance, and you become substance-free. Whereas the
human body/mind is tuned into substance. You close the eyes, and then
you are out of substance. If you are out of substance then you became
unchanging Knower. Unchanging Knower can see all the changes and will
not change. But somehow by birth unchanging Knower by mistake began to
see himself as a changing form. And that can be rectified through satsang,
and I am here to inform that you close your eyes and watch unchanging.
And when I say watch unchanging you are fashioned as if you are watching
a bird sitting on a tree. No. You are now fashioned in this awareness
that I am watching the sky. You have become separate and sky has become
separate. And that is where we have to totally inverse or reverse: The
Space alone is. That’s it. Many people say, “Space alone is, but from
mind side it is not.” But there is no mind that from which side you have
to take it. Space alone is. That’s why we are at a place that every one
of us whenever you have meditated, Space has taken place. No, Space is,
not taken place. You realize, and you begin to realize the Space. Space
has been, only it was covered by the body, by the things, by the thoughts,
by the forms. So now Space alone is. Having shared with me I always am
in sympathy and tell you that you have the power to identify. If you,
the Knower, identify yourself to be the body, mind and senses, then you
turned into that. Yet, you are still the same Knower who can identify
with the purity of the Knower. I say purity so that changes should not
be your criterion of understanding, and then you become that Amaram
Hum Madhuram Hum, pure, free, forever. Since we are one and the same,
we can use two names. Sometimes we say I, it’s alright, and we say family,
and there are ten persons, and we say world has millions of people. But
it doesn’t matter what you say, it is all the same, same, same awareness,
forever pure, free.
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